Secret Cupet episode: promoting rape "culture"?

[Methid Man]

I've heard that there's at least one mouth-breathing feminist out there who feels that the cupid-induced wooing of the male pets in this episode promotes a sort of "rape culture"...

Clay Satterfield said:
I once ran into a Tumblr user who hated it because of the fact that the wooing moments were uncomfortable for kids to watch (Boy pets about to go rapey on the girls), and fears for a bad message to empower boys to do the same thing to their young girl classmates. She's also an anti-rape culture activist, and can understand her views that rape culture needs to be stop in everyday life.

Now I'm curious to know who this oversensitive twat is and where I can find her review... First of all, there's no such thing as a "rape culture". That's not to say that rape itself doesn't exist so I'm not denying that, but there's no "culture" behind it. Let me provide a definition of the word "culture" for your convenience:

cul·ture
noun
1. the quality in a person or society that arises from a concern for what is regarded as excellent in arts, letters, manners, scholarly pursuits, etc.
2. that which is excellent in the arts, manners, etc.
3. a particular form or stage of civilization, as that of a certain nation or period: Greek culture.
4. development or improvement of the mind by education or training.
5. the behaviors and beliefs characteristic of a particular social, ethnic, or age group: the youth culture; the drug culture.

When's the last time you heard about people joining rape clubs or publishing rape magazines or putting up rape art in museums? When's the last time you were taught rape lessons in school? When's the last time you ever saw the Rape Channel? Did you ever see anyone defending Todd Akin's "legitimate rape" comments? The only ones promoting this "rape culture" are the radical feminists who invented that term to play the victim card.

WomenAgainstFeminism.tumblr.com said:
Since Feminism is all about playing the persecuted, weak, helpless victim, feminists have promoted the fantasy that we live a culture that “teaches men to rape”. But nowhere is rape taught as acceptable. Rape is illegal and is seen as a crime by most people in society. Feminists confuse dominance and submission themes as rape. Only rape is rape. Posing in a picture for perfume is not rape.

I also want to point out that there are lots more murder scenes than rape scenes in movies, yet nobody even says we live in a "murder culture". Wanna guess why? Because no where in our culture does anyone promote murder as something acceptable when in fact it is actually ILLEGAL.

Let's get back to the more relevant side of this topic: the pets. Explain to me how Sunil, Vinnie and Russell were "raping" the female characters? Especially considering it wasn't even their fault that they were FORCEFULLY put under the influence of a love spell sung by a FEMALE character? That's practically the same thing as sneaking date rape drugs into someone's drink. Where's the outcry in THAT? Oh, but I forget that only females can be victims; who cares about the males, nothing bad can possibly happen to them.

Keep in mind this is a KIDS cartoon. The Hub would never have any sexual content in any of their kids shows, so how in the world could this scene suggest rape if there's no way we could ever expect to see sex? You could say they were forcefully showing affection, which BTW is common in cupid plots, but affection and sex are not the same thing. Nowhere in this scene do you see them poking their wee wees out (and let's not forget they were FULLY CLOTHED) nor do we see them getting into any sexual positions. Anyone who so far as fancies the idea has to be sick-minded.

The overall theme with this episode was love, not sex, let alone rape. To all you feminazis, you're the ones bringing the concept of rape into a tame cartoon scene. You're the ones whose heads are in the gutter. Even children who watch this show know better than to suspect any rape tendencies in cupid plots.

[Methid Man]

Excellent and informed reply, Clay~ Yes, I'm aware of that TIME article and it's what helped me form some of my post, although I haven't come across that one eloquently written comment by monicabenton24g. I must say, it was a very enlightening read and I agree we must come up with a sort of balance to both address the reality of sexual assault and at the same time make sure not to vilify the male species. It saddens me to say as a male that I do have a certain fear of being accused of sexual misconduct for even the most benign situations to the point where I've even pondered carrying a camcorder with me in any event that involves women. Having seen the statistics for false accusations of rape (which I hear is around 40-45% contrary to what the feminists would have you belive), the world seems like a scary place for me and I feel this is the sort of the world feminists wanted to create.

I sound like I'm bashing feminism here and I am, rightfully so. When you get right down to it, feminism has degenerated from an equal rights movement to a misandrist revenge movement that has become too gynocentric and one-sided to be taken seriously. Case in point: this leahcinnamon brings up her perspective on what she feels are rape undertones of the male pets' actions toward the female pets. In other words, she puts herself in the place of the female pets and only the female pets, but nowhere do I see any outcry over the male pets' side of the dilemma.

If there was one thing in this episode that really stood out as wrong, it was Sugar Sprinkles' unwarranted manipulation of Russell's emotions all for her own entertainment. As I said before, it's like sneaking a date rape drug into someone's drink. Forcing someone to love is just as bad as forcing someone to have sex and while those of us who have half a brain didn't see anything sexual, we know for sure that the male pets were forcefully manipulated to do what they went through. It's this conveniently ignored male grievance why I'll never take feminism, or leahcinnamon's comments seriously.

Despite how uncomfortable I may sound with what I just described in this episode, I nonetheless have the capacity to shrug it off and enjoy the episode for what it was meant to be. Unlike leahcinnamon, I don't take this cartoon too seriously and neither should anyone else.

[theblackwidower]

Isn't it great that one gets alerted when someone posts a link to their blog on some other site?

Anyway, I feel I should point something out: Rape culture exists. It's a real thing, despite the fact that I wish it wasn't. It's not that people think it's okay, or acceptable, but sometimes people don't know what rape actually is. I know one story where a girl was drinking, someone slipped her a roofie, and someone else, a friend of a friend, had sex with her. Took her quite a while to realize that that qualifies as rape.

Then there was an episode of Game of Thrones where two characters had sex over their child's dead body, all while the woman was screaming, "No!" And the director filming it didn't realize that qualifies as rape because "'it becomes consensual by the end."

Then you have the relatively famous story of the CNN reporter, reporting on the story that several men were just convicted of raping a fellow college student, and her report focused on just how tragic it was that these young men had their lives ruined. She didn't seem at all concerned about the woman who was raped!

That's fucked up. And how many cases are there of unreported rape?

I actually have a lot more on this, but I think the point is made.

And all that being said, that episode of Littlest Pet Shop, Secret Cupet, did not promote it, in any way. This is for several reasons, number one: There was no sex, and I'm pretty sure there wouldn't have been any unless it was consensual. 

Okay, sure, they did try to kiss the girls, which certainly qualifies as molestation, if nothing else. But there's another point to be made: No one saw this as a good thing! No one saw Russell try to shove his tongue down Penny's throat and said, "Oh, keep at it bro." They all knew this was fucked up. Even Sunil and Vinnie noticed, which was why they were going to go after Sugar, before they were hit by the spell themselves.

Okay, sure. Sugar Sprinkles did try to justify it. But then she actually saw how far it got and said, "Alright, that's fucked, I need to reverse this."

If anyone tried to justify the situation, after being fully aware of it, then one might have an argument. But that didn't happen. No one will see this episode, and think molestation is a good thing. That's just asinine.

And as for Baa Baa Lou and Josh. I think we should presume the spell wears off over time. Though that wouldn't mess up Baa's relationship because love has a tendency to run pretty darn well on inertia. See, the love spell triggered their relationship, but it doesn't need to sustain it. And as for Josh... well from what I saw, Blythe did seem to have gotten over him by the end of the episode. So any future episode might involve Josh trying to woo Blythe, and Blythe trying to let him down gently.

But now we're just getting nitpicky. The point is, no one in the episode tried to justify the situation. Therefore, I don't see how it promotes rape culture in any way.

[Methid Man]

Jul 22, 2014 4:56:15 GMT -5 theblackwidower said:

Isn't it great that one gets alerted when someone posts a link to their blog on some other site?

Anyway, I feel I should point something out: Rape culture exists. It's a real thing, despite the fact that I wish it wasn't. It's not that people think it's okay, or acceptable, but sometimes people don't know what rape actually is. I know one story where a girl was drinking, someone slipped her a roofie, and someone else, a friend of a friend, had sex with her. Took her quite a while to realize that that qualifies as rape.

Then there was an episode of Game of Thrones where two characters had sex over their child's dead body, all while the woman was screaming, "No!" And the director filming it didn't realize that qualifies as rape because "'it becomes consensual by the end."

Then you have the relatively famous story of the CNN reporter, reporting on the story that several men were just convicted of raping a fellow college student, and her report focused on just how tragic it was that these young men had their lives ruined. She didn't seem at all concerned about the woman who was raped!

That's fucked up. And how many cases are there of unreported rape?

I actually have a lot more on this, but I think the point is made.

As messed up as all that sounds, I still don't agree why the word "culture" has to be coupled with it for the same reason nobody ever says we live in "murder culture" despite death and murder stories being far more prevalent in the media. The definition I posted still stands with the point I was trying to make.

But everything you said regarding the Secret Cupet episode was spot on, I couldn't have put it any better than that. Only thing I disagree with is Blyth getting over Josh, but that's a different topic.

Anyways, welcome to LPS Daycamp~

[theblackwidower]

I could continue arguing, but I'm not going to. It's obviously pointless.

I just wanted to ask if anyone had the exact link of the person in question complaining about the episode promoting 'rape culture.'

[Methid Man]

You know what? I'm going to completely ignore that link, because I already know I'm going to disagree with everything she says with pure disgust and she doesn't deserve the attention for it whatsoever. I'll take the higher ground this time and just shrug this off by treating it as something that doesn't deserve my time...because frankly, it really doesn't.

[internet google lurker]

Hi, I hate to necro a thread on a hot-button issue of a forum I don't read, but I came across this from a completely unrelated search and felt compelled to comment.

I think your definition of culture (sourced from dictionary.com/Random House, which isn't exactly staffed by the most exacting or subtle of lexicographers and editors) is limited. Here is the full definition from Merriam-Webster, with pertinent definitions bolded:

1: cultivation, tillage
2: the act of developing the intellectual and moral faculties especially by education
3: expert care and training <beauty culture>
4
a : enlightenment and excellence of taste acquired by intellectual and aesthetic training
b : acquaintance with and taste in fine arts, humanities, and broad aspects of science as distinguished from vocational and technical skills
5
a : the integrated pattern of human knowledge, belief, and behavior that depends upon the capacity for learning and transmitting knowledge to succeeding generations
b : the customary beliefs, social forms, and material traits of a racial, religious, or social group; also : the characteristic features of everyday existence (as diversions or a way of life) shared by people in a place or time <popular culture> <southern culture>
c : the set of shared attitudes, values, goals, and practices that characterizes an institution or organization <a corporate culture focused on the bottom line>
d : the set of values, conventions, or social practices associated with a particular field, activity, or societal characteristic <studying the effect of computers on print culture> <changing the culture of materialism will take time — Peggy O'Mara>
6: the act or process of cultivating living material (as bacteria or viruses) in prepared nutrient media; also : a product of such cultivation (source)

5.d is the most specific, but keep the others in mind. 5.a is also fundamental to what people mean when they say "culture" in this usage.

Also, an important foundational idea here is "male gaze" and how women are depicted in media. In short, the idea is that a large swath of female representations in media (specifically visual mediums like TV and photography, but the basic concept carries over into any method that humans use to structure/make sense of their world; things like books, the stories we tell each other) are heavily influenced by the male's gaze, or the male viewpoint, or the historically dominant viewpoint in our culture, which we have inevitably inherited through centuries of male dominance in our culture. Ah, but perhaps I ramble. Quoting Wikipedia's summary of the person who developed the idea:

The male gaze[5] occurs when the camera puts the audience into the perspective of a heterosexual man. It may linger over the curves of a woman's body, for instance.[6] The woman is usually displayed on two different levels: as an erotic object for both the characters within the film, as well as for the spectator who is watching the film. The man emerges as the dominant power within the created film fantasy. The woman is passive to the active gaze from the man. This adds an element of 'patriarchal' order and it is often seen in "illusionistic narrative film".[7] Mulvey argues that, in mainstream cinema, the male gaze typically takes precedence over the female gaze, reflecting an underlying power asymmetry.[citation needed]

Mulvey's essay also states that the female gaze is the same as the male gaze. This means that women look at themselves through the eyes of men.[8] The male gaze may be seen by a feminist either as a manifestation of unequal power between gazer and gazed, or as a conscious or subconscious attempt to develop that inequality. From this perspective, a woman who welcomes an objectifying gaze may be simply conforming to norms established to benefit men, thereby reinforcing the power of the gaze to reduce a recipient to an object. (source)

Okay, so deep breath. I've been dropping truth bombs all over the place, up the wazoo and down to Cameroon, and usually with labyrinthine syntax and parentheticals. Let's take a breather. Here is something we can all agree on:


yes

Alright, so to summarize: male gaze is when a woman is presented from the point of view of a stereotypical male. This includes tight and lingering shots that frame her body in a most appealing way, and dismissive or completely ignored presentations of her point of view. The prevalence of both of these integrate into a larger pattern of viewing reality, in which women are treated as objects, their identities are indelibly sexualized and evaluated against how closely they resemble the culture's dominant perception of beauty. A side-effect of all this is that it promulgates what is termed "rape culture."

From wikipedia's entry on rape culture:
Rape culture is a phrase used to describe a culture in which rape is pervasive and normalized due to societal attitudes about gender, sex, and sexuality.[1][2]

Examples of behaviors commonly associated with rape culture include victim blaming, sexual objectification, trivializing rape, denial of widespread rape, or refusing to acknowledge the harm of certain forms of sexual violence that do not conform to certain stereotypes of stranger or violent rape. Rape culture has been used to model behavior within social groups, including prison rape and conflict areas where war rape is used as psychological warfare. Entire countries have also been alleged to be rape cultures.[3][4][5][6][7]

Although the concept of rape culture is used in feminist academia,[8] there is disagreement over what defines a rape culture and to what degree a given society meets the criteria to be considered a rape culture.[3]

Rape culture has been observed to correlate with other social factors and behaviors. Research identifies correlation between rape myths, victim blaming and trivialization of rape with increased incidence of racism, homophobia, ageism, classism, religious intolerance, and other forms of discrimination.[9][10]

Do the knowledge. So in other words, rape culture refers more to a set of social practices and beliefs that allow more rapes to happen by stigmatizing and discrediting the raped and making it harder for them to find justice, which in turn enables rapists to keep raping. It doesn't mean everyone is a rapist, or that everyone is tacitly saying "yes, go rapists!" But what it does mean is that there are subtle and pervasive ways of understanding and negotiating reality that create fertile grounds for more rape, and that many of us unwittingly say and do things that keep them going because these memes are so deeply embedded in how our society describes and perpetuates its world.

[Methid Man]

All I can say is, considering the way this thread evolved into, I'm glad I moved it to the Fridge.

And that dog is cute.

And I'm supposed to be in bed.

[raritytrent1992]

I wouldn't know as I've only recently decided to give the show a second chance and started over right from the beginning so seeing as how I've never seen the episode before I'll give you my thoughts on the episode at hand after I finally see the episode.

[Methid Man]

Okay, so...here I am, 9 years later, and I'd like to post my updated thoughts on this matter because it's been haunting me for a while even though this forum is pretty much abandoned and almost nobody visits it anymore, but I still feel the need to give an update in case someone does come across this thread because it's still linked to my name. Here goes:

Due to events in recent years, especially with the overturning of Roe vs. Wade last year and observing how politicians and right-wingers perceive women, I've come to realize what people really mean when they mention "rape culture" and I've come to understand, with sadness, that rape culture is a real thing... My main argument when I made this post years ago was that nobody considers that we live in a "murder culture" because murder is illegal. Regardless of whether something is legal or not, there is unfortunately still a culture behind because, well...just look at our cop situation... We certainly live in a gun culture because guns are so prevalent and many people who argue in favor of guns have pretty much made it clear at this point that they very much to kill people with guns; they certainly care more about guns than children's lives. With mass shootings being as rampant as they are now, we definitely live in a murder culture...and likewise we live in a rape culture because so many voters and legislators have made it clear how anti-women they are and how they very much want young women, even girls who haven't entered puberty yet, to bear children... They're already trying to make child marriage legal again. They're already trying to turn this country into The Handmaid's Tale...one person even outright saying “We will not stop until ‘The Handmaid’s Tale’ is a reality and even worse than that.” (Vincent James)

So it is with great pain and sadness and disgust that I realize with the rise of the alt-right that we do live in a rape culture and I'm ashamed for making this post. I'm sorry, everyone... I wish we could've lived in a better world...